Probiotics & It's Effect On Gym Gains

Garage Gym Athlete
Probiotics & It's Effect On Gym Gains

Hey, Athletes! Do you take probiotics? Thinking of adding them to your supplementation? Then make sure to not miss out on this week's newest episode of the Garage Gym Athlete Podcast! 

Episode 117 of The Garage Gym Athlete Podcast is up!

Probiotics & It's Effect On Gym Gains

In this week’s episode we have Jerred, Joe, and Trampis. The guys dive into the study about probiotics and how it can effect your body composition and your performance during training. They give their takeaways, applications, and best ways to kill comfort with this one! This week’s topic is intrinsic vs extrinsic motivators. The guys talk about how to find what truly motivates you and how it can keep you going when it comes to training. Lastly, this week’s Meet Yourself Saturday workout is DiCarlo. 

If you haven’t already, be sure to subscribe to the Garage Gym Athlete podcast either on Stitcher, iTunes, or Google Play by using the link below:

Subscribe on any device HERE 


  • Probiotics  
  • DiCarlo
  • Intrinsic vs. Extrinsic    
  • Gut Health  
  • What Motivates You
  • Tips For MYS
  • Updates and Announcements
  • And A LOT MORE!!

Diving Deeper… 

If you want to go a little bit deeper on this episode, here are some links for you: 

Study of the Week 

Garage Gym Athlete Workout of the Week 

Be sure to listen to this week’s episode:

Related Resources at End of Three Fitness: 


Thanks for listening to the podcast, and if you have any questions be sure to add it to the comments below!

To becoming better!



Jerred Moon 0:02
Alright, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the garage, a mathlete podcast podcast. It's just trampas and Joe here today, can't say podcast, she's always a good start to the podcast. Now I've said it enough times where I know not to mess up podcast. We're gonna get into it. We are covering a study today on probiotics and its relation to let's just say overall health, I wouldn't say to athletes, but I have a lot to say on probiotics in general. And we're also going to be talking about intrinsic versus extrinsic motivators, and things to look out for either when helping family or even for yourself, if you're looking to stay motivated and do things for the right reasons. And then we'll get into a meet yourself Saturday workout, but we're going to start with updates, because we haven't done updates in a while. And do you normally jump straight into the study, but we have some updates, company updates, if you will, but I'll go over I'll go last. But that that definitely need to be mentioned. And just hear from the team. You know, see how you guys are doing what you're up to? How's life? I'm gonna go with you, Joe. How are things man? What updates do you have for us in the in the world?

Joe Courtney 1:15
Nothing too crazy special, except that I ran three times this week, which doesn't sound that crazy. But you know, considering how the weather has been ridiculously hot in Bahrain, that it's felt good, even though the humidity is still out the wazoo and crazy and terrible. So I come back humid there, too. Yeah, like it's been in the 80% humidity.

Jerred Moon 1:39
Which is, that's like the worst place on Earth. weather wise, right? I mean, it's like 120. And like 80% humidity, I just, it's not fair. Normally you feel one or the other.

Joe Courtney 1:49
At the at the hottest, it would be like 99 to 100 102 outside, and then it would be humid. So that's why it would be in a one to 120s. Now it's like 85 to 88. But 80 plus percent humidity, so the temperature is still 105 to one out of eight. So like today's run, I was that about 108. They were pretty much all week actually, when I run it's been about that mid one of our 108 range. But there's actually air movement, so somewhat of a breeze which in the summer, also when it was 120 something, no air movement at all. There's just stale, non moving air.

Unknown Speaker 2:22
It's terrible blows all that hot air on your face. No,

Joe Courtney 2:25
there's no blowing.

Jerred Moon 2:27
And if we listeners he's in ba rain if you're unaware of a word josaphat

Joe Courtney 2:33
so ran through it three times outside, which is nice. And I didn't want to get into more running anyway. Training wise, all good. I think. Not too too special. much else. I don't think unless you think of anything.

Jerred Moon 2:49
If I can think of anything for you know, what, what do I have going on? Um, I don't know you've been all over the country lately. Or the world world.

Joe Courtney 2:57
Yeah. I went to Denver two weeks ago from my brother's bachelor party for about five days. That was a whole lot of fun. Even though it was Yes, within a week span, I was flying 23 hours twice. But more that, just that that. I mean, it wasn't enough time to actually acclimate for like circadian rhythm. But yeah, so that was kind of kind of messed me up for a couple of days, or about a week. But good to go. Now, back to running. I like it. Awesome. trips.

Trampis Beatty 3:30
Yeah, I am in a new location. This is my biggest update for the last five days. I didn't beat Jared chronologically, but I beat him Tom was my office took about five days.

Jerred Moon 3:43
And mine took over a year.

Unknown Speaker 3:46
But to be fair, the building was already here. And if you saw the other side of this, you would think you're not even close to finished. But it's fine. It looks good in the background. Other updates, I'm actually starting a new day job next week. So that's pretty fun. I've been out of work for a few weeks now but I'm gonna get back to the old grind next week. Sounds like a good opportunity for me. I'm in construction for anyone that doesn't know. That's also why I was probably able to get this done so fast as I was the GC so Jared having to deal with other people

Jerred Moon 4:22
and having to start with like no foundation. Come on. That's that's a big thing right there.

Unknown Speaker 4:29
But training wise, been good. I got four solid days of indoor last week and that kicked my butt and then I jumped straight into building out this office. So I have I've been like near zone two for the last five days. For eight, nine hours every waking hour. Yeah. So I'm glad that I'm done though because I can get back to just more focused training, I guess. But other than that, doing good

Jerred Moon 5:02
Yeah and I had like two weeks of that when my backyard flooded and I was just like well I gotta clean this up. I was shoveling mud and let's just call it landscaping type work for two straight weeks and it was just now it's all I was doing you know I was just like constantly like you said in zone two I was just like Yep, shovel this wheelbarrow get rid of it over and over again. It's good for you though. You get like you can work out all the time and you still will find out after doing manual labor like that you're sore somewhere that you go wow, I guess I don't train the bottom right side of my lower back.

Unknown Speaker 5:41
And then the sleep like I generally sleep good especially when I'm training and I'm eating well I generally sleep good but like there's my wife had to work late the other night and she came home and I had I had no recollection that she was she was even in the house she she came in I I told her the next morning like I have no idea you got home I said you could have been a murderer we did that I had no idea but I've just I've slept like a rock the last couple nights and it's been great

Jerred Moon 6:11
that's awesome. Alright so updates for me I don't know if it's officially even being been announced when we were giving updates I was building an office the office is built I'm in the office so if you're on YouTube you can see I'm in a slightly different location than previous but for the listeners it's not that much different for any of you but I am in the office it's it's complete so really happy about that to have eo three HQ kind of established and away from everyone else um that's about it. Like Yeah, in the nicest way being away from the kids and those kinds of things but um that's it lifewise yeah training I'm back on htk off of bt BCT and loving htk I'm still slowly chipping away at back squat and my all time stuff but I'm not gonna commit to anything like I'm I'm still going for it just much slower right now to make sure I don't get hurt again. Now as far as big company updates that I mentioned, we posted this or I posted in the Facebook group and just so everyone's aware, we've kind of split up into three fitness and garage gym athlete. They have had this weird inter mingled relationship over the years and it was it was done accidentally it wasn't like on purpose it was just garage mathlete kept growing into three fitness was kind of growing in a different direction and it just did there was a lot of confusion and even with the URL you know we used to have crude industry fitness COMM And originally crude into three was just supposed to be kind of like the members area of industry fitness going back all the way to like 2015 but then it kind of grew into like that's where everybody does everything and it's really where everybody was doing garage gym athlete. So anyway you know, it's all kind of like technical stuff I don't know how much people care like our athletes care but there is no crude industry fitness comm there's industry fitness comm which is for educating current and aspiring coaches so we provide education on programming mindset, digital business, online business, that kind of stuff and then garage gym athlete is what you know, it's this podcast, it's daily training and there's garage so there's two websites two different purposes same team but that was a lot of work we've been doing you know, stints of work behind the scenes because it's not needed the main thing that we we do around here for months, you know, it's been something we've been working on for a long time. And they're finally split apart and there's gonna be new stuff with that but um, how this applies to the athletes. Like I mentioned, there is no crew to enter through fitness comm there's only garage mathlete comm so if you've ever purchased anything from us ever, it's at garage gym. right now doesn't matter what it is. If it was one man, one barbell a garage mathlete membership doesn't matter. It's all a garage gym with your current login credentials that you should have always had. And if for some reason you can't remember him, just try to log in and use that forgot password and it'll shoot you your password. And then if you've never purchased anything from us or ever logged in, you can fix that. You can actually go to garage you can sign up for a 14 day free trial. That's a great way to get an account and get things started. But uh, yeah, that's it. Did I miss anything, Joe?

Joe Courtney 9:31
No, but how's your re acclamation into hard to kill been going?

Jerred Moon 9:36
It's been good. It's

Unknown Speaker 9:39
I was pretty mad has not been good. But

Jerred Moon 9:42
well, I told you guys in the team meeting and it's kind of funny because the first week of hard to kill was a three we squatted three days that week. And it was just it was something I had to do with the programming. I wasn't trying to like make people squat that much but I wanted to fit fit in a certain type of strength programming in the first wave and three days of squatting had to happen somewhere because we had to testify rep max and so I did it and so I did those three days and then we had this kid in he lives in local area he really wanted to work out with me. That was kind of like I don't know on his bucket list or something like that his dad recently passed away my mom's very well connected in the community got word to me that this is a big thing that he wanted to do him and his dad I guess wanted to work out with me and his dad passed away and so now he's just seeing if he could work out with me and I was like absolutely and so he came over on Sunday that first week of hard to kill and I had no idea is like what someone request to work out with you I'm like, What do you want to do? Like I mean, there's certain type of workout you want like cuz if you just come over to my house we're just gonna do Murph like that's that's what's gonna happen but he's 15 years old so I'm not gonna like try and crush the kid and he's in football and he was like, I want to do legs and I was like awesome. Okay, so you want to do it so that was my first week of hard to kill was the three squat sessions and then on Sunday a fourth squat and deadlift session so I was pretty sore. That was my reactivation. I don't even know if that was the first was that the first week yeah that was the first week of hard to go so yeah, that was I was brutal but overall it's been awesome I really missed doing different things if you will like just more stuff so it's it's been a lot of fun so far.

Joe Courtney 11:29

Unknown Speaker 11:30
And to be fair, I'm not on hard to kill but indoors been tough as well despite the shirt

Jerred Moon 11:36
right? This change it to GTA for life.

Unknown Speaker 11:40
Did you ever live and not have to do that

Jerred Moon 11:42
thing Chris Morgan's The only one sticking to htk for life. He's the only one is actually holding it down now.

Unknown Speaker 11:48
Levi will complain complaint he was complaining about mountain climbers for something

Jerred Moon 11:51
another day. Mountain Climbers are awful, especially when it's 30 of them that for count. Yeah, those are not good. Alright, let's get into the study its effects of probiotic supplementation on anthropometric and metabolic characteristics and adults with metabolic syndrome, a systematic review and meta analysis of randomized clinical trials. I feel like I don't have to explain much just from their title. It's a systematic review. It's a meta analysis of what randomized clinical trials so that's what they were looking at. They did pull a bunch of studies they had inclusion exclusion criteria. I think overall they pulled 10 publications and it got down to even less than that about 344 total participants. So they're interested in body weight body mass index in waist circumference as body composition outcomes, and they were interested in total cholesterol LDL, HDL triglycerides, fasting blood sugar, blood insulin levels and insulin sensitivity as biomarkers related to cardio metabolic health, so they really just wanted to see how probiotics influence these things influenced body composition and biomarkers related to cardio metabolic health. And I think we've talked a lot about not a lot but you've probably heard us mention probiotics on the podcast a few times at least. And I've definitely had mixed opinions over them on them over the years but I think there's a lot that we could get into and I think the discussion on probiotics is going to be more important than the study because all the study turned out if you guys pulled out anything interesting let me know but the only statistically significant thing that it reduced or affected was total cholesterol and didn't really do much else we could look at the graph for every single thing but I think also jumping into who the study was even looking at the type of person is something that we could discuss and then get into a lot more of his gut health really that important are probiotics really that important? And these are the things that I want to talk about but what do you guys pull from the study

Unknown Speaker 14:03
what you just said there about being it was it the right person or talking about the person like I wondered if somebody that's in metabolic syndrome is the right person to test with this was such a small change it maybe it's a bigger change than I'm making it out to be but like you're not gonna see a lot of benefit from just changing your probiotics if you have everything else going wrong with your body like is your weight even going to change that much to me you would almost want to get somebody that's pretty well fat adapted or something like that that you know can change weight quicker or a little maybe just a little bit healthier I guess and then see if their weight changes.

Jerred Moon 14:41
So you're saying that probiotics are not an easy button for those people who are metabolically unhealthy it's like

Unknown Speaker 14:47
well, you're getting into my killing comfort but like, I don't think I it's not it's not a you're not going to take this one pill and all of a sudden you're going to lose 1015 pounds. You know 50 pounds because of that like to me the study did a good job of picking of the the studies that we're going to look at and but I just didn't know that this was the right participant for

Joe Courtney 15:15
for this study I think I might see why they did it because it was such a basic thing of like hey we want to see what effect probiotics have there was no fitness there was there was no diet protocol it was just like hey these people are overweight to obese in their BMI category so they're gonna have the most to gain and they probably already have a bad gut health anyway because if you have actual fit people they might actually have decent gut health already so like if you seeing if there's going to be that monumental of a change but also what you were saying is that like hey this isn't a This isn't an easy button fix all but what if we just change this one thing see what if they have more to lose probably easier or a turnaround but yeah, like whenever

Jerred Moon 16:04
a squat protocol and they always pick untrained people just because

Joe Courtney 16:08
kind of like that version yeah like hey we want to see if the the results blown out even more because if not then they would have had probably had to have the studies be much longer versus just like one or two weeks I think a minimum was one week which is like nothing Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 16:27
I think throughout the study if you just keep reading they suggested like a mixture of probiotics if you if you are going to pursue it versus just you know, see, you know, Google ad or something, some sort of clickbait that says this probiotic helps you you should, you should try to get a wide range but even that it to me is so complicated because they're you know, nobody knows how many probiotics they are, I guess they add they have estimates on how many there are, but like, nobody knows, because the other thing I looked up was like one bite of sauerkraut has like it has 50 has 100 times the amount of the normal or the average probiotic pill. So that's cool.

Jerred Moon 17:10
I've never heard that comparison. Yeah, I'm

Unknown Speaker 17:12
thinking it was a it was mercola Dr. mercola he's you know, sort of a health fitness doctor guy but he said that his homemade sauerkraut was tested in a lab and it was it was 100 times stronger than just an average probiotic pill and that's one bite so you know, I know a lot of people don't like vegetables but my killing comfort is to a eats and then vegetables but then try to work your way into a little bit more diverse foods and you know really a lot of the studies sort of pointing towards fiber and getting more fiber for the probiotics to work anyways. But I don't want to take everything that Jim I wanted to say but go ahead Jeff,

Joe Courtney 17:59
that's fine. Yeah, I think this would have been a this could have been a better one this is almost like a first step to me like kind of study and even within the study they mentioned doing stuff with with gut health and probiotics with division one athletes and elite rugby players and like seeing their performance or body composition metrics with them so like I would love this I would love to get into those studies and make it even like a bigger discussion but as far as this I think the longer this would have gone on it would have had more payoff down the road. So they saw the cholesterol went down and like overall cholesterol but not one specific they also I saw one of the charts within all like all six studies it wasn't a significant weight loss but everybody lost a little bit of weight and every single one of the study was like just about the same exact amount it wasn't very much but it was a little bit and every every all of them were the same as well so I think over time that could have helped more you know just just reversing your gut health could help you clean up and you're going to lose some weight and some inflammation if you are in the obese category it is a it is a step in the right direction but it is not the fix. So and what you were saying about you know sauerkraut having 100 times more supplementation also isn't the answer. And I think this is probably something that Jared probably get into about you know, and some of the mixed thoughts of probiotics in general is that it's just another marketing term. It's another thing that people can slap on stuff but you don't need to have the supplementation or go looking for whatever package things that says oh with probiotics because half of them and I think this is covered in fiber fuels like the ones that are labeled like that they don't make it past your stomach Anyway, you need something a little bit better and more natural because as your stomach breaks down the probiotics actually happen more down the down the chain so like with actual fermented foods instead of something in the pill because it's probably just gonna be wasted in your stomach acids. So that's just a little bit off the side for gut health and I've always been a big to advocate for gut health, and all this kind of our, the more I've learned about it more, and everything is going to be individual to you as well. So even, you know, with these six or so different studies, they found that the more strains of probiotics they had, the better. So the more diversity that you have, the better you're going to be, which means different foods and different everything. But also, you don't really know what strain is best for you, and everybody's got health is going to be completely different. So it's more unique, like a fingerprint. So getting a good bio diversity of what you're eating, then you're pretty much gonna hit on the strains. And you don't have to worry about taking a bunch of supplements to just like, carpet bomb and hope that you get one of them with all the supplements. And also, you're probably not going to be consistently taking supplements anyway, because it's just like, I have vitamin D sitting on my on my desk to take because I know vitamin D is important. I probably take like once a week, they're gonna try and get outside a lot. But like, it's like, that's just like, I know, it's important. It's right in front of my keyboard.

Unknown Speaker 21:03
Vitamin D, do you need vitamin D on an island nation?

Joe Courtney 21:08
I don't go outside everybody like now that I'm running? Yes, I don't need as much. But like, guiding me I try and get outside. Either way. Yeah, so it's just focusing on on the better quality of food is the the main thing. And obviously, when we said about fiber fields, this is another plug for I guess that, um, and my killing comfort would be to eat fermented foods, I try and eat at least like four times a month. So whether it's something fermented, or like kombucha we Liz makes makes ours. So we always have some readily available. And, yeah, just try and make it as natural as possible. But fermented food, you don't need to have that much you can just have like a little four ounce thing of, of something, a couple of bites, and there'll be better than what you're doing.

Jerred Moon 21:58
Yeah. So my thoughts on this are, I don't feel like there's an argument at all for saying gut health is not important. And so I don't want anybody to come to that conclusion, when you look at these supplements, or the studies that are looking at supplemented probiotics, and they're like, Yeah, well, lower cholesterol a little bit, so whatever, you know, but there's not really the same. So this I mean, to be honest, we could just say, like, wrap this up with go read fiber, fuelled all of it, and, and see what that guy has to say, Dr. B, because it's pretty crazy last name. But it's a it's a great book, and he does talk about, he has a section on there. So if you want to read about probiotics, and he pulls a lot of the research, and it was it's pretty much says, similar to some of the things Joe says, and it's like, yeah, like, if you get really high quality ones, they can be effective. But how do you even know those are the strains that you need. And so you actually have to get your poop like analyzed to know like, what's missing, to be able to have this like reverse engineered like probiotic for you. And I guarantee you within the next 510 years, that's the thing, like I can guarantee it, like everything's moving towards personalization, I guarantee that you can send in a stool sample and have some sort of reverse engineered probiotic designed for you and that'll be great. But until we get there, taking these you know, Walmart brand probiotics, hoping that they're going to solve all your gut problems, it's not going to work. And so I would there's not an argument to me that gut health is not important. I think the science is very clear there. But this the probiotics, I think, if you are going to take them, they have to be extremely high quality. And you might not even necessarily need them because we don't know like Joe said it's a it's as unique as a fingerprint, you know, what you need the the gut bacteria that you need. So I do think supplementation is tough. But all of the things that these guys are saying I agree with, you know, like, let's have a more diverse diet. Let's eat a bunch of different fruits and vegetables. Let's eat our fermented foods. And you know, we're going to be pushing the right direction for gut health. Because for me, though, the reason I've always felt focused on gut health is because if you just kind of look, if you take a step backwards from being an athlete, and you're like, I want to train more, I want to see more results. It's like, Okay, well, you need to recover better. It's like, Okay, well, how do I recover better? And then we can get into we could talk about sleep, we could talk about hydration and food. But if we really want to go back one step further to answer how do we recover better? One of the answers to that question is going to be have a better immune system. You need the most, you know, robust immune system possible, and it's going to help your recovery as an athlete. And so once you find out all those things are interrelated. Then you're like, Okay, well, how do I have a better immune system? You're gonna take one step back and you're gonna land on gut health. Like it's it's not gonna be the only thing but it's going to be amazing. thing that you know, then this is more news in the medical community, I'd say over the last one to two decades, how important gut health is connected to your immune system, your brain function and everything else. And so I think it's really important to focus on your gut health. But when we say focus on your gut health, it's not going to say it's not going to be go take your probiotics. Now, if you have high total cholesterol, and you want to try and reduce that, this seems they had a significant reduction in total cholesterol. So maybe taking some storebrand, like generic probiotics to lower cholesterol if you feel like that's a problem. Give it a try. But other than that, we're not seeing a lot of things in the positive for them. But there was another study that I pulled that looked specifically at fermented dairy products, and cardio metabolic disease. And it was another systematic review and meta analysis, and it was done in where's the date on this thing 2020.

And just not to like unpack an entire another study, it was more favorable for a lot of the things that we're looking at as far as cardio, cardio, metabolic health is concerned, it was more favorable. And so trampas mentioning, one bite of fermented food has more probiotics, like maybe there's a lot of truth to that, especially with this fermented dairy products. Because when we look at people actually eating food for probiotic, and then analyzing it, it seems like the results are more positive, much more positive than when we look at just, you know, taking a couple of pills. So definitely focus on your gut health. And that's kind of my killing comfort is try to try to make gut health a priority in your diet. Like I know that some people are keto or vegan, or you know, whatever you whatever camp you want to sit, and that's fine. But Can Can you overlay into your diet protocol, gut health, I was like, I'm trying to focus on gut health. So I'm going to get more fiber, I'm gonna eat more fruits and vegetables, all these things, I'm gonna eat fermented food. So that's my, my killing comfort tip for everybody is is try to focus not just on carbohydrates and macronutrients and fat, but let's also focus on our gut health with fermented foods and eating a diverse range of plants, I think is ultimately my, my takeaway and killing comfort there.

Joe Courtney 27:22
And just one more anecdotally, from what I was saying the other studies that were related to fitness people, um, there was one done that looked at high protein diets, and compare them with low fiber and not unlike sufficient fiber. And so high protein can affect your gut biome in a negative way. And being athletes, most people you know, we tell people to focus on protein for one. So if you're getting sufficient or high protein for whatever you're doing, you got to make sure you balance out with fiber as well. So that's kind of like the the one b i guess, to make sure you're getting enough protein, but also you need that if I ever needed to go along with it. So your gut still stays fine. And like, you know, there's, there's, I know, there's been times where people go to super high protein, and they might either get stopped up or something like that. It's because you're not getting a fiber because to higher protein will negatively impact or get by him.

Jerred Moon 28:16
A takeaway, so that is, probiotics in our thoughts in some of the science, a lot more thoughts than science, but hey, we're super smart. So you should listen to us,

Joe Courtney 28:28
we have 116 other studies that we've gone over,

Jerred Moon 28:34
just publicly. Alright, we're gonna get into intrinsic and extrinsic motivators here and why they matter to you. So this is something

Joe Courtney 28:43
it's internal and external. Oh,

Jerred Moon 28:46
I will be saying inter intrinsic and extrinsic. You can also refer to as internal and external if you'd like. He threw me off for a sec. I was like, Am I covering the wrong topic? Are we in a different week? Yeah, actually, Jared, it's something else Mike. Well, this is what I'm prepared to talk about.

Joe Courtney 29:02
I spell one of those words, internal next.

Jerred Moon 29:07
Alright, so um, overall, we talk a lot about this in the EEO three coaching course. And the reason is because you have to uncover if you're your coach, you have to uncover what your athlete truly wants for them to succeed. Now for any athletes listening to this, you need to do that for yourself. If you don't have a coach who's kind of walking you through a process we maybe we can do some of that here today on the podcast, but we go over the five primary elements for a an elite performer and it's a motivational climate, mentors life experiences, psychological skills, and the insatiable desire internalized motives to succeed and that last one is the one we're gonna be talking about a little bit more as these internalize motives, what keeps an elite performer going, and it's almost never some silly extrinsic goal, you know, like lose 10 pounds or something like that. It's rarely ever that and to be honest, it's really rarely ever actually, that if you think about it, if you just sit down and think for a few minutes, if you're like, hey, I want to lose 15 pounds, and I just go, Okay, why do you want to lose 15 pounds? And then your easy, simple answer probably be something like, I want to look different. I want to look like the person who weighs 15 pounds less than I do. Now, I'm gonna ask you again, why is looking 15 pounds lighter, important to you? And you're gonna have to answer that question and I'm just gonna keep going and going and going every time you answer that question, until we really find out that it's actually has something to do with how your parents treated you when you were a kid and like, we're down there, you're crying. And you're at this really deep emotional level. And now I'm like, Okay, great, we found out why you really want to lose 15 pounds. Let's write that on our whiteboard. Let's put that on our bathroom mirror. We're at these deep level and intrinsic motivators. So August some examples of some here in a minute in everything but what I just you know, we're just kind of talk about them in a broad sense, do you guys think about these intrinsic versus extrinsic or internal versus external motivators? Because I don't think that there is you know, I don't want to take a crap so to speak on the external too much because I there's some, sometimes they're needed, you know, they get the spark and going so it's not like, they're horrible things, and you're a horrible person for for focusing on those things. It's just, if you want to stick to it, it might need to be a little bit deeper. What What do you guys think about these

Joe Courtney 31:34
cameras, you have a lot more than I do.

Unknown Speaker 31:36
Okay, I thought so. I think that it's, it's important to remember Yeah, we want a good, solid, intrinsic motivator, because that, to me, that is what sustains, like, over decades, that's gonna keep you going for the long haul. But I think it's also important to use extrinsic when you need it. And so you've got to insert that at certain times to stoke the fire and you know, I think Marco said it good on his podcast, motivation or, you know, whatever you want to describe it as, I think he used to like he likes us discipline but dude, more so than anything like you have to believe it, you can't just put it on the wall and you have to become it almost and you know, my intrinsic motivation for training or you know, whatever it basically and everything in life is so that I raised two strong men and that's that sort of end mob and also have a good relationship with my wife, that's it. But you've got to remember that every day is going to be different. So I honestly the last few days, yesterday especially I did not want to I did not want to work on anything, I just wanted to sit on the couch but I knew that I had a podcast coming up. So I used that extrinsic motivation to get me through yesterday. And it's important just to use both I kind of look at it as intrinsic is the fuel that keeps the car going and extrinsic is the steering wheel day to day that that moves the car in the direction that you need to go and that's that's how I've always looked at it right so it's important to use both and and you want to get to where intrinsic is really all you need, but you're going to have to use extrinsic from time to time to to keep the fire going.

Jerred Moon 33:32
And let me jump in real quick and just give the list I have here of intrinsic and extrinsic for each just in case anyone listening wants few more examples. So like just to be more physically fit would be a little bit more intrinsic weight loss, extrinsic, good health, intrinsic physical attractiveness, extrinsic enjoyment, intrinsic toned body, extrinsic, social interaction, interaction, intrinsic, impress others, extrinsic, enhance self esteem, intrinsic rewards, extrinsic, develop friendships, intrinsic satisfy competitive desires, extrinsic, reduce stress, intrinsic relieve boredom, extrinsic, improve skills, internal build muscle external so I can say those words anymore. And then post something really cool on Instagram, external extrinsic, you know, so it should become pretty obvious and clear after hearing a list like that, where you probably fit in if you are listening to this. But yeah, Joe worried thoughts on this.

Joe Courtney 34:43
So I always just thought about this as more of like an application standpoint of like how you're going to get them as well. And that's like outcome goals versus process goals. Yeah. And the extrinsic or the external goal will be more of like an outcome goal that like it. To the output of what you're going to get from the process goal that you set out. So in, and so like if you, you know, internally, it's, um, it's building the habit, it's building the process. And that is your goal to set this process. And then at the end of the goal, maybe eventually you will hit that outcome goal, but your focus is on the process, and the outcome will come. So they kind of go hand in hand. And like, a lot of times the goals, the motivation is kind of a subjective thing. And intrinsic motivators are typically more subjective. Versus extrinsic, and did that external reward is more of objective, and you can't, there's only so much control, sometimes you can have an objective, but the process goal is going to be your subjective goal of how you go about doing this goal, and then it's going to be achieved. But as long as you like, even if you don't hit that outcome, you should still feel good about that process. And the internal goal that you achieve, because you did what you set out to do internally with your process with with all that, and if the outcome or the external reward didn't quite pay off, it wasn't like a total loss. But if you only have focused on the external, that you didn't hit that number on the scale, or that number on the weights, then you're just gonna think of it as I lost it all versus Hey, you know, I did all that could, you know, 90% of the way and then it was just that last 10%, that I just I just came up a little bit short, but it's not a total loss. So that's just my quick thoughts on those differences. And I guess reframing and mindsets toward internal versus external motivators?

Jerred Moon 36:38
Yeah, I think that's good. When I talk about a personal goal setting versus something like let's say business goal setting in business, it's very easy to be like, it's a number, right? It can be a certain amount of people, customers revenue, something like that, it's very easy to just be like, boom, that's the goal. But that's a lot harder in our lives. It's a lot harder to be like, you know, what? I goal equals good marriage? How? Like, how do we know when that's accomplished? And then can you stop once it's accomplished? And so no, right? And so, what you're talking about with process goals, that's how I set up almost everything in my personal life. It's not it's like okay, if I want a good marriage, I have to go back to Okay, how many dates are we going on this month? And you know, what activities or actions Am I taking, you know, to make her feel loved or to be appreciated? and tracking the process of those you know, and then we can get into the deeper reasons of intrinsic versus extrinsic why you would you'd want those things but ultimately, if you want that happiness for another person you know that's that's a deep level of intrinsic motivator to stay focused on the process goal to ultimately achieve what you're you know that Yeah, we all want a good marriage and that's that's that that's even a little bit extrinsic. You know, it's, it's, it came but it can be like if you really lay it out but ultimately the process of how you getting there and just staying focused on the process there has to be huge internal reason to continue down that path. Like I said, it is a little bit different when you get into like a business metric, or even like in fitness, those things are a little bit more like there's still process involved. But when you achieve these things like 15 pounds lost or a 500 pound back squat it's kind of done you know, there's not like there's no more to do you have done it you know, so I think the process goal and being able to just stick with the process for the longest period of time is what's important and two things that I always talk about people when you're setting goals is enjoyment and competence the two things I'm always going to hit on so do you enjoy the thing that you're about to pursue the process that the daily doing? And is it something going to the competence now that can expand your skills can challenge you and will you grow in the process in study after study after study proves that those two things are needed if you look at specifically the self determination theory, those two things are needed for people to succeed. So you need to enjoy the process and it needs to be expanding your skills. So if it's something that's boring and monotonous that you don't feel like you can get better at it's not something that you're going to want to do that's why I think a lot of fitness programs fail because when you look at ours, like one enjoyment is subjective right with like, let's say the hard to kill track. You might enjoy overall how its programmed because we're hitting a lot of different areas and everything but yeah, the training session might not be quote unquote enjoyable. But the competence side I think that we add a lot of that to our programming. So something that you can get better at you can be challenged in you can grow like zone two, I can't tell you how many of our athletes stuck to zone two and they came but every time they do it, they're looking to get better and better and better at zone two and they see that they This is something I'm getting better at running, my heart rate is lowering at the same, you know, level of physical output. And you're getting you're you can track it, you can see it and it's not just this, I lost five pounds, you know, it's something that you can actually get better at. Because you One could argue you could get good at losing weight. But what kind of skill is that? Like, after you've lost the weight? Like what, how do you keep practicing that skill of losing weight, you're gonna end up with some psychological problems or actual physiological problems if you go too far down that path. So in fitness, you want to be looking at things that are going to expand your skills or challenge you. And that's why I like getting into things like cycling, because there are people who dedicate their lives to the sport, right? And I'm not ever going to do that. I'm taking little bite sized chunks of cycling, like once a week, and I'm finding out one, one ride at a time what I suck at and how I can get better at it. And so it keeps me going. That's it, there's a competence level there. And I also enjoy it. So those are the two things I think every athlete should be looking for if they want to be successful in their their goal setting for fitness.

All right. Well, I have nothing else to say. Yeah, enjoyment, competence, and go for those intrinsic goals and stay away from the extrinsic ones. And if you are like I started with, if you have that extrinsic goal, just ask yourself, why over and over and over again, like walk yourself through that process. And you will probably find out why you ultimately want what you want

Joe Courtney 41:32
is a good starting point.

Jerred Moon 41:35
Yeah, like, I love this example. It pops up in the entrepreneurial world quite a bit. And people are always like, so say, I'm like, hey, do you want to drive a Ferrari? And you're like, No, I don't want to I'm not that type of person. Like I don't, I don't want to be the guy who drives a Ferrari. But you have a why either way. So if you're the person who wants a Ferrari, there's something deep rooted in you, that wants it. Maybe just want to prove to other people like you did something, you accomplish something, you know. But there's also the person who says they don't want that. There's something that you don't want to be perceived as in owning a Ferrari. That also is just as deep rooted in the same as the person who wants to own the Ferrari. Sometimes, I don't want to be that guy. Don't be all flashy. And it's like, well, that's probably because looking modest or being this way, like it means something to you, it's important in your life, for some reason to be the guy who doesn't drive the Ferrari or who doesn't want the Ferrari, you both have the same mental issue is it's just opposite end of the spectrum. You know, and so we need to find out what those are. Why are you the guy who doesn't want the Ferrari? or Why are you the guy who wants the Ferrari? And it's the same case in fitness? Like, it doesn't matter? You're you have an answer to this question. But you need to keep asking yourself why? And to find out why you ultimately have that desire or lack of desire in this area. Alright, how does Mike drop it there and go to the workout who wants to brief the the meet yourself Saturday this week?

Joe Courtney 43:10
I have it up. So it is decarlo. And I actually forget it, how it actually fits all three. I think it's all three exercises away in our minds written right there. Yes, so it's a breathing ladder. So if you're not familiar with breathing ladders, it goes. Whatever rep you're on. That's how many breaths you take in between as your wrist so you would do one rep of an exercise. Set it down. If you're doing something that you sit down, take one one actual breath. They do two reps, set it down two breaths, 3344 all the way up to whatever the ladder is. And I don't know why it's always asked but you will breathe normally during the actual exercises, you're only counting the recovery breaths in between your number sets. So you got to make sure those those breaths count, but the decarlo is a one to 15 back down to ones ascending and descending breathing ladder of kettlebell swings burpees and double unders. So you will do one kettlebell swing, one burpee, one double Ender, and then take your one rest, one breath, rest, and then two to two, two breaths of rest all the way up to 15 and then all the way back down. It is a very hard very long, one time we'll stand still, especially when you get to the teens. But in and there's a 16 minute time cap.

Jerred Moon 44:37
And just to like, throw in here like it is a challenging one it's on it's on purpose because the workout is named Carlo. That's the last name of and decarlo she was part of our programming and involved in eo three coaching and stuff and, and she passed away from her. Yeah, a battle with cancer and And ultimately, her husband, and I'm not sure if he's still listening to the podcast or anything. But Tim, he's in the programming now. And he's still still, you know, knocking it out, we see him in the community and stuff, which is, which is awesome. But yeah, very active in the community. But this is in memory of one of our athletes who has been around the community for a long time. And that's also why the workout is, is very challenging and why I it's like the CrossFit hero workouts, I have a lot of respect for those workouts, but they can get lost at times, you know, and that's my fear sometimes with Murph as well, like just the doing Murph, every time is like, yeah, we want to take it off the pedestal of the, the physical illness, the physicality of that, but never the memory of what it represents and what it stands for. And it's the same with this workout, like it isn't your Saturday, it's the only one that we currently have dedicated to someone who's passed away. So just, you know, put that in the forefront of your mind when you when you tackle this workout breeding ladders in general are awful. And then to do one letter, yeah, to do multiple different exercises, in an ascending and descending fashion is about the best way you could probably remember someone through physical activity as possible. Um, so my tips or tricks for this one is just breathe, you know, like, don't like really focus, take your time, if you need to call this workout, cut it short, I would rather you do a modified version and know that going in. So you'd be like, I've never done a one to 15 to one before. So maybe do a one to 10 to one or a one to five to one, something like that, because it is long. And I'd prefer you finish some sort of level of it, as opposed to just realizing you can't handle it and quit, you know, so decide that going in. Because it will take a long time. Because how I recommend people breathe when you're doing breathing ladders is not just normal. It's not just like, you know, like, however you end up breathing, you need to control your breath. And so when I get to like 15 breaths, that's taking a long time for me, like I don't, I'd have to tighten it. But I'm intentionally trying to use that as recovery and breath control. So my inhale and exhale are taking very long periods of time, I'm trying to control that as much as I can. And this is where time really builds up in in the, in the workout itself, just because you have not only the exercise movements, but you have these very long controlled breathing periods. If you can, now there is a way that you're I mean, if for some people, if you've never done them, your breath might get so erratic, you are unable to keep up and that's also kind of where you'd get kept in like you should start going down. But um, yeah, control the breath is my biggest thing with these just make sure that you are really really controlling the inhale and the exhale as much as you possibly can. And getting the most out of it. You can in memory of an

Unknown Speaker 48:03
My only tip is I mean you're you're hit it with all the breathe in breathe normal or close to normal when you're doing the work, but also just take care of your hands because then kettlebell swings. Or if you choke up or just do all you can do that fun one.

Joe Courtney 48:21
Yeah, so each exercise, I'd say you don't have to rush through each of them, you know, so like, burpees, you, if you want to make it harder, obviously go fast. But you can do like three to five second burpees. Just so you can because you're breathing during those exercises. It's not, you're not redlining to knock those out. I'm sure Jared, you're I am seeing that.

Jerred Moon 48:39
I'm seeing that question come up less. But I know you already mentioned it, but the How do I breathe during the exercise? It always cracks me up. Because like

Joe Courtney 48:47
my supposed to hold my breath there. And yeah, like

Jerred Moon 48:51
we're only talking about breathing in between here not during the exercise that would that would add some complexity there for sure.

Joe Courtney 48:58
Yeah. And if you I mean, if you're proficient kettlebell swing, you're like I know myself and Jared, we do like the quick swings, we kind of shorten the range range of motion. Maybe do full just so you have ecollection how to get so when the kettlebell is above overhead, there's a point where it's kind of just locked out and breathless and stable and you just take a breath then during the exercise, but what I do during reading ladders is during my breaths, I will have a box that I sit on to put my arms off to the side so that I can fully take in those deep breaths and so that I can like fully go in nasal breathing. by seven reps by seven breaths. Those breaths are hard, like to really stay to stay disciplined to do deep breathing, but also you get a little dizzy because your heart rates hammering away but you're just like really slowing your breathing down but it really really pays off toward the end if you if you keep up with it the entire way. It's it'll get dicey as you get into the teens, but Making sure you can control the breeze as much as possible and sitting down might help to lower your heart rate a little bit versus and you know I need to do is stand up a little bit versus going full on fetal so that's what I would kind of recommend to rest as best as possible get that same with the with the breathing but I even sit down and have my arms spread out so that I can fully breathe

Jerred Moon 50:24
and per the science The best way to recover during exercise is hands on knees not the view position actually did that one when I don't remember if it like

Joe Courtney 50:35
it was it was up there Yes, but it was just like when are you going to do that? I was like well I do it sometimes.

Unknown Speaker 50:40
Yeah, so it's probably the most convenient and most efficient is hands on knees Yeah. Getting on the floor on the floor.

Jerred Moon 50:47
Yeah I read

Joe Courtney 50:48
when you were short shorts I've noticed this on my runs

Jerred Moon 50:52
I ran with a buddy who came in town the what was it the is a few weeks ago and he we finished the run and we finished hard and then he put his hands over his head and I put my hands on my knees and to be honest I've always kind of naturally done that I know the science supports it but that's kind of what I've done and he gave me the old like coach it Get your hands off your knees and I was like how about you read some science buddy and then I

Joe Courtney 51:20
elected him back to the house let me let me educate you to tell you why

Jerred Moon 51:25
you should have your hands on your knees and not on your head and anyway so yeah that's the best way to recover and something definitely worth trying during breeding ladders

Unknown Speaker 51:33
I remember a second or third grade in elementary school whatever PE and it was put your hands on your head and I've forever until that study when y'all did it like that has been the recovery position even though it never really felt great

Jerred Moon 51:50
football coaches they'd be like there's no good air down there you know if you put your hands and knees like what are you talking about? Air is the same everywhere coach you know it's just like they it i don't know i think laying down is kind of a sign of giving up and weakness but hands on your knees I've never had problem with that I think it's a great way to recover so

Unknown Speaker 52:09
it's probably more of a you're you're taking the weight off your back so now you're putting it on your knees and so that they're looking at it as more of a you're being like I guess lazy in the way you recover just funny

Jerred Moon 52:23
yeah let's be smart about it right all right, well I think that one wraps this one up if you are interested in just all we've got going on I mentioned the website change so you can go to end of three fitness comm it's brand new looks completely different and more for coaches and what what coaches are looking to improve so go check out into three fitness comm if those things interest you also garage gym athlete a brand new garage, gym athlete inside and out so yeah, the outside looks different but if you log in you'll see even the members area is a little bit different on the inside. So go check out the two two websites and you know if you can't find anything like the merchandise which we still need to throw on there if that one is mirch dot garage gym and we'll make sure it's linked on the on the main page. We were having some problems with that part of the migration but it's all resolved now so don't worry about it everybody merchandise is still there. Trump is still here.

Unknown Speaker 53:27
That's my last podcast it's big right everybody

Joe Courtney 53:29

Jerred Moon 53:31
Yeah, so I was actually worried about that. I was like, this doesn't seem to be clicking over like But no, we're all good now. So go check out the different websites and see some of the new resources that we have and everything. And if you're brand new, it couldn't be easier to sign up for 1414 day free trial with how we think have things set up at garage mathlete calm right now so you can go there snag a 14 day free trial, get indoctrinated into the program, check out the members area and everything that we have going on. So definitely do that. And for everyone who's been a part of the community and still you know putting in the green dots put in the work, applying the science the workouts, just thank you guys for for making the community awesome each and every single day we really do appreciate you. Now for the weekly reminder if you don't feel comfort, comfort will kill you.

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